Friday, September 23

(Comment Required) Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse Sept. 23

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbJPaQY_1dc

17 comments:

Anonymous said...

Maybe a better title for this video would be how to get the cute girl with confidence from the play ground to like you. It seems to be rules for making friends in kindergarten (for adults). This is not to say I don't agree with the speaker. It just seems that the partners in a MASTER RELATIONSHIP have maturity at a higher level than those in a disaster relationship. Is it their personalities or their "love" for one another that allows for the correct interactions? Does this take into account happy relationships that have one over giving mature individual that compensates for the others more child like behaviors? How do we learn from this data if of course it is based on ones personality? I think these findings point to a personal growth that needs to take hold of one's self but mutual love is probably important as well.

Jonathan Bellino

Bianca Sturchio said...

After watching this video, I realized that John Gottman's areas of focus: Criticism, Contempt, Defensiveness, and Stonewalling, are all negative ways of responding to unfavorable situations. In my opinion, if a couple wants to lessen the chances of having a 'failed' relationship, both parties need to be able to respond to disagreements in ways that are healthy, and constructive.

The couple needs to address problematic issues with honesty, sensitivity and consideration as to how their partner may be feeling. But I think the most constructive way of responding would first be with a calm, rational mind. If an individual is upset, they may use an automatic response which could potentially be hurtful.

I also believe a key component of successful relationships is responsibility. Individuals need to take responsibility for their actions, and be proactive about the way they handle themselves.

Lastly, I think a relationship will have a higher probability of success if both parties feel as if they have open lines of communication, and feel safe to engage in conversation about things that are bothersome. Without open lines of communication, I do not think any of the above mentioned can be actualized.

-Bianca Sturchio

Anonymous said...

I completely agree with everything Bianca said. I know from experience that dealing with arguments with any of the "four horsemen" will eventually lead to disaster in any relationship. Each person involved needs to put his or her ego aside and deal with a situation like that with understanding and reason. Communication is infinitely important in any relationship, and if you can't listen or voice your opinion without hostility and contempt, neither party is going to be satisfied. In relationships, you have to work out problems in a constructive way by listening and coming up with a solution to a problem together instead of yelling, blaming each other, acting as if the other person is wrong, etc. None of these things will lead to resolution; they will only cause more trouble in the future.

Anonymous said...

I also agree with what Bianca and John have stated. I believe that these "four horsemen" will make any argument worse. I have experienced these from time to time both as the recipient and the one doing it, and I know it definitely just escalates the argument. I agree that people need to be mature enough to work together during an argument, as John stated. Also, as Bianca stated responsibility for one's actions is a huge necessity in any relationship. I believe in most instances, time to think alone about what you're going to say, helps the argument to become resolved quicker and less painfully.

-Chelsea Craig

Anonymous said...

This video was really interesting to me on a personal level as well because I have experienced all of these horsemen in different relationships. It is obviously likely that everyone has experienced at least one or a few of them at some point. One of the biggest that I have caught myself doing was contempt, I often think i know more than they do or am right in the situation. But I have experienced defensiveness, criticism, and stonewalling all in one relationship. It makes things extremely hard to fix.

Jacqueline Nizer

Anonymous said...

This video is all about couples and how there are masters or disasters and how these different couple types interact and react to one another. I personally think disasters is a good name for the interaction of people who are critical and blaming one another for things. For those who try to "diagnose" their partner as he put it and tend to counter attack and whine about the problems instead of resolve them. Masters as a name type I guess makes sense but I always believe as humans we have flaws so that perfection title they are given is a bit over glorified. I think there is a category of couples that tend to act in a gentle and responsible manner and are interested in listening and learning from their partners.

What about the couples in between? Is it black and white that couples are one or the other or is this more of a spectrum is something I left wondering about.

Beyond all that I must say that stonewalling is something I know for personal experience because it is what my significant other does and this seems to just add more dry wood to an already lit fire when you are in heated conversation with that other person. We personally have worked over the past four to five years on it and I can say that he has grown from the experience. He does not stonewall anymore like in the past but is better at trying to be more gentle and understand when it comes to heated conversations or talks that can have disagreements. I think this shows that as Jonathon Bellino was asking about it being maturity or personality. I think its a mixture of both. I think that people can mature and learn from the experiences but I believe that your personality is what makes you that way and it cant be denied that it plays a role in how you react and handle things. I would add that past experience and environmental upbringing would have an impact because if you see the disaster relationship of parents or relatives than it is more of a chance that you will learn to behave and react in those manners that you are accustom to growing up.

I however must add that I am skeptical when it came to him talking statistics about how based on a conversation they can predict 96% of the time in a conflict conversation whether a couple will get divorced or how happy that couple will be. I find that a bit hard to believe. I am skeptical when it comes to his grad student studying couples with a pregnant partner and how much they argued in the last trimester predicted the child's temperament and neurological well being. I think this may have some legitimacy but its hard to believe that maybe its not the arguments that continue after the child is born which is predictive in a couple under the disaster category that actually has the effect and if that was intervened and couples did not argue as much after the child being born that maybe the temperament and neurological well being of the child would be the opposite of that which would be predicted.

Overall the video covers some terms and makes a few good points like how you handle confrontation and problems in a relationship will have an effect on the end result. Though the video alone I found a bit dry and not that informative. I feel like this needs more support and needs more depth. It was very surface oriented and covered a few basics and the basic idea he was pushing for.

I am unsure of what type of studies would help convince me to look more in depth into this idea at the moment but I do think it lacks information or sources that it pulls its data from.

Christina Valeriani

Unknown said...

I enjoyed this video. My relationship is a big priority in my life so i love learning about ways to improve it. It is easy to agree with everything said in the video. Most people know how they "should" act. Obviously it is more productive for a relationship to act in a gentle, constructive, respectful way when arguing with a significant other. The problem is maintaining that mentality in the heat of the moment. When you're furious its difficult not to be aggressive, and be receptive to whatever your significant other may be saying whether its blame, insults, things that just escalate the fight. I think the most important thing is for both people involved to be equally dedicated to making the relationship work. It takes a lot of practice and sometimes just giving each other space to cool down. And of course maturity helps.

Gina Maarmanik

Anonymous said...

What I got out of this was two things. The first is that from my experience on the planet I have seen few really good relationships, maybe a handful of friends, and sadly one or two family members. He talked about the fact that people need to know what a good relationship looks like.Much like the theme to this class, after taking enough classes (and living)we know what maladaptive behavior looks like but not always exceptional,positive behavior. It's true, when people mess up in a relationship, as everybody does, it needs to be repaired. People are growing and sometimes get it wrong when moving to the next level.
The second thing is that no matter what words you want to label it, relationships are built on being honest. The first person you need to be honest with is yourself, otherwise you will probably dump your garbage on your partner while not being able to admit and work on your own shortcomings.

Brandon.Dion said...

contempt was interesting. they found that their immune systems were suppressed and could see the amount of infectious illnesses they will get within 4 years. with contempt, the negativity from putting people down and shutting situations out will result in an increase in cortisol due to stress and that would be the reason for the lowered immune systems. the disasters must have been statistically more sick than the masters.

Anonymous said...

I have a hard time accepting what John Gottman has to offer in this video. Do I feel he has a valid point? Yes; however I'm not sure to what extent I find this useful. I think it can be determined that if a couple has developed such patterns of negativity in a relationship it may not be hard to predict the future of the relationship or the future conversations. Humans are creatures of habit and many times we find ourselves in a constant circle and far too little time is spent trying to find ways out. I heard Gottman mention something about interventions but he did not mention what steps were needed in the intervention process. I would be curious what he has to suggest.

Also another area that Gottman mentioned that I am a bit unclear about is when he mentioned friendship in a relationship. Is it to suggest that "disasters" don't have as good of friendships as "masters"? Or is it just suggesting that the "masters" have more of a focus on repairing and building purpose,meaning, and shared experiences? What classifies as a friendship in an intimate relationship? To what degree does a friendship need to be established?

A couple should be focused on building and strengthening their friendship/relationship and shared meaning as well as shared awareness. I think addressing awareness is key and was the most interesting point in the video. It is rather hard to be aware of what you're doing or saying when in the midst of an argument, but trying to be more aware seems like it would reduce stonewalling, and contempt.

I wish the video addressed a lot more than what was covered only because I feel it just dusted the surface of a very interesting and crucial aspect of our lives (relationships).
-Lauren Goudreau

josieda lord said...

I'm in agreement with
Christina Valeriani. I'd love to see the actual research upon which his assertions are based.

The things that come to mind for me are:

Are we predisposed to think of relationships in certain ways?

Is there any way of avoiding the indisputable relationship between observer and observed in a realm (close relationships) which clearly has such an impact on everyone's lives? By which I mean, do any of us NOT have close relationships of the opposite sex-same sex-however yourpreferencestrikesyou-nature? Isn't that a consideration which needs to be accounted for in these studies?

Anonymous said...

I think Gottman makes some valid and obvious points. Couples who are more critical of another, less respectful and less understanding of one another are likely going to end up in a failing relationship. It is not surprising to me that "repairing" is what predicts better relationships. I wonder if he considers compromise as part of the "repairing" process.

I found it interesting that contempt was specifically linked to a higher divorce rate as well as a higher likelihood in the who received the feelings of contempt getting a disease or serious illness. I wonder how the emotion contempt is directly related to our immune system/response. I would be interested to see if the emotions related to contempt closely resemble fight or flight or stress, which may release cortisol which is linked to immuno suppression. The video had some points that I thought were good and interesting, but also some points that I think are not completely new in theory, however it is always exciting to have such a large amount of data to work with.
I would also like to get a little more info oh the idea that they were able to predict with some accuracy the temperament and development of a child based on the couples argument styles during the 3rd trimester. I would like to understand more about this correlation for sure.

Jessica Hews

Anonymous said...

I found this video really interesting. The researchers ability to predict the strength of a relationship, with 90% accuracy, amazes me. I am interested to see the results of this study. Gottman stated contempt can help predict the number of infectious illnesses in the next four years the recipient of contempt will get. After hearing this, I thought about how important it is to me to have healthy, positive relationships in order to be happy.
-Nick Randall

Paul Bavineau said...

This research by Dr. John Gottman demonstrates that loving, long-lasting, positive romantic relationships require a high level of respect and gentleness for the thoughts and feelings of a person’s partner. A person will show an ability to see the feelings of their partner as valid and completely real for that individual. They may disagree, of course, but they approach the person and the problem with a deep level of respect, love, and maturity.
A few questions came up for me with regards to the concept of “stonewalling.” As noted by Dr. Gottman, there seem to be some positive attributes to stonewalling in the sense that the person is withdrawing in an attempt to stop the escalation of the argument. Perhaps this could be expressed in a different way, such as asking for a timeout, or time to cool down. The disagreement could then be approached in a less amplified way.
Additionally, maybe there are different styles of stonewalling, and furthermore, maybe those styles are far more detrimental to the relationship. I have always viewed stonewalling into separate ways. The first is the style that Dr. Gottman outlined resembling a complete emotional shutdown where the person turns away from their partner and goes quite. The second style goes something like this:
Person: “Sweetie, I was wondering if you could slow down your driving. I’m feeling a bit nervous, on the edge of my seat and unable to relax. In general, I don’t feel safe. Besides, we’re in no real rush to get to the park.”
Partner: “This is how I drive. I always have and I am not going to change. If you don’t like it, perhaps you should find someone else. This is me. Take it or leave it.”
I find this to be a form of stonewalling. It is not just defensiveness. It is an attempt to shut down any further discussion of a subject, in this case a person feeling unsafe by the driving style of another. It puts up a wall to further discussion. The partner is saying, “don’t bring this up again. Case closed!”
Dr. Gottman spoke about relationships as two people building a life together. So, it is not only a partner’s maturity and ability to repair disagreements within a relationship. A person must choose to love, meaning that their willingness to let go of anger, frustration, etc. and work with new concepts of conflict resolution hinge on the fact that they actually want this person in their life for a long time. They are choosing to build a life with this person; therefore, they are choosing to love this person.
This is an extremely important aspect of the potential of a relationship. The use of the “Four Horsemen” may be symptomatic of the larger issue of commitment to longevity.
~Paul Bavineau

Anonymous said...

It's really interesting that they were able to look at a couple's style of discourse and predict how they relationship would work out. It makes sense that relationships with open lines of communication are going to fair better then those where one partner blames another. That just causes people to shut down.
I loved that he talked about how relationships did well when they maintained their friendship and tried to maintain a sense of meaning and purpose. There are findings that community building activities reduce racial or ethnic tension, so it's funny how the same principle's apply.

josieda lord said...

After further reflection:
If we exhibit signs of any of the four horsemen of the apocalypse in our relationship, do we throw up our hands and walk away, try again with someone else? Or are we doomed to repeat the same mistakes over and over? What's the treatment??

Anonymous said...

I personally believe Johns point is about prevention and if those factors are present in our relationship we must look to find alternatives when expressing ourselves. Its not about walking away and starting over it about identifying whats in the way when looking to improve your relationship or reflecting on past relationships to improve future ones.

I also feel John is providing a tool that some of us desperately need. I remember someone saying the points made by John are obvious. Let me ask a question, if everyone knows these statistically significant variables that cause relationships to fail, why is the divorce rate in America so high (assuming that married individuals truly wanted to spend the rest of their lives together)?

I believe John's findings have great importance to those that want a happy and healthy relationship(-: